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“They want 1939 Germany but they're going to get 1789 France if they keep fucking around.”
Its not going to end wel nor normally…
i remind myself of #fascist #spain under #franco and look at spain today
doesn't mean spain is utopia today
doesn't mean "it's going to be ok, relax"
it means getting better is real
but:
1. we have a lot fucking work to do
2. there is a lot of fucking suffering ahead of us
3. do not accept #pessimism #cynicism nor #capitulation
as long as we *fight* we can right this rotten ship
biggest ally of #maga:
lazy indifference
get off your fucking asses and fight
i know what it's going to take
it's been really fucking easy since fucking gore v bush in 2000:
you stupid fucking lazy ass moronic americans:
YOU. NEED. TO. FUCKING. #VOTE.
if it comes to molotov cocktails then i'm throwing molotov cocktails
but that's a failure
some airhead fuckwits romanticize that bullshit
it's massive suffering!
narcissistic college sophomores cosplaying revolutionary thinking they're in a fucking movie: deeply cringe
just fucking vote shitheads
@otownKim @benroyce @jm101 @xs4me2 With respect (because I'm a poll worker and take this stuff seriously): I wish fewer people would joke about this stuff.
Elmo didn't do shit. I sat behind the table and looked at people coming in, then saw the returns that night. Even with anonymous votes, at the level of an individual polling station you can gauge the vibe of the room by the familiar faces you see and the familiar faces you don't.
People just didn't show up to vote for Harris. Period. I thought lefties had learned their lesson in 2016, but apparently I gave them too much credit and they needed to be told twice.
@mark
> People just didn't show up to vote for Harris. Period. I thought lefties had learned their lesson in 2016, but apparently I gave them too much credit and they needed to be told twice
Funny, I was thinking exactly the same thing about the Democrat leadership and their candidates choices. The left didn't turn up, because they didn't have a candidate on the ballot. Period.
@strypey @mark @roknrol @otownKim @jm101 @xs4me2
that's not the way it works
you have it backwards
you don't get your candidate, and then you show up
you show up, and then you get your candidate
you're shifting blame away from lazy entitlement
lazy entitlement is the problem and why we don't see more candidates on the left
people better fucking show up in #primaries2026 like a fucking mob
@midgephoto @strypey @mark @roknrol @otownKim @jm101 @xs4me2
i just got in argument with an australian about how much voting and parties suck in australia
i don't doubt them, but as an american i got really angry because they have ranked choice (what they call preferential voting)
that's like nirvana to me
but, it's whiny assholes all over the world
everyone gets some shit, but some don't understand how good they have it in comparison
which is also the reason why the usa is going to hell
@benroyce
> as an american i got really angry because they have ranked choice
With you on this one. If the US gets a second go at creating a democracy, a proportional representation system for major elections is a must-have. Having voted in both MMP and ranked choice elections, I definitely recommend the latter.
@benroyce
> and we get that change. BY SHOWING THE FUCK UP AND VOTING
No, you don't. What get by voting is Clinton and Obama. To get electoral reform you have to make a credible threat to tear capitalism a new one, so radical changes to the electoral system seem like the lesser evil. The idea that voting in effectively rigged elections changes anything is magical thinking.
@strypey @midgephoto @mark @roknrol @otownKim @jm101 @xs4me2
with all due respect, you haven't the slightest fucking clue
you don't get any of the things you listed that you want, that i also want, unless you vote
i can't say anything else to you
if you can't grasp why, there's nothing else to be said between us, because you're absolutely clueless
"you have to make a credible threat to tear capitalism a new one"
ok, i'll go get my gundam suit
@benroyce
That's a lot of piss and vinegar there buddy. Hold into that, you're going to need it. But if your strategy consists entirely of voting more you don't even have the first clue about electoral politics. Let alone the revolutionary politics that is clearly required in your current circumstances.
@strypey @benroyce @mark @roknrol @otownKim @jm101 @xs4me2
From over here, Clinton (either one) looked quite effective and competent: and Obama may be remembered in history as "The Great".
Biden was clearly useful and qualified at running a large important country.
Sanders, maybe a bit old.
Krasnov, less good in all areas.
(1/2)
(1/2)
@midgephoto
> Clinton (either one) looked quite effective and competent
Clinton I continued Reagan's dismantling of the post-WW2 mixed economy;
The one that made the US the envy of the world, and which the Chinese emulated to lift millions of their people out of poverty. Clinton II was a neocon war criminal;
https://www.foreignpolicyjournal.com/2016/10/24/hillarys-war-crime/
Widely loathed, for this she had a snowball's chance in hell of beating Drumpf.
@strypey @mark @roknrol @otownKim @jm101 @xs4me2
But this
"Widely loathed, for this she had a snowball's chance in hell of beating Drumpf. "
simply isn't true, is it.
That election was not quite as close as the one that could usefully - for the world - have returned Al Gore, but it was so close that only the oddity of the electoral college system failed to deliver the candidate with the majority to office.
@midgephoto @strypey @roknrol @otownKim @jm101 @xs4me2 Ever been so widely loathed you actually won the popular vote over your opponent?
She didn't win it by a wide-enough margin to overcome the state-based bias against raw popular vote, but any assertion she wasn't popular is objectively, as-measured false. She wasn't popular enough.
@benroyce @midgephoto @strypey @mark @roknrol @otownKim @jm101 @xs4me2 We have proportional representation in Ireland too and feel about it the way the NRA do about guns (cold dead hands). Benefits include every vote counting and more consensual politics - because everyone wants a preference vote. Demonizing a rival is a sure way to lose votes.
Also
No gerrymandering (boundaries decided by independent body)
&
Strict limits on political donations & public funding for parties w 2%+ of votes
@benroyce
> you don't get your candidate, and then you show up
So in a parallel universe where the candidate choices were reversed, you'd be dressing down the left for not turning up for Drumpf, and blaming them for Harris and her techbro mates demolishing the federal government? Spare me.
> lazy entitlement is the problem
Sure is. The Democrats think they're entitled to the left's votes, however right wing their candidates. Turns out they're not 
@benroyce
Seems you're fundamentally incapable of understanding how right wing neocon candidates like Clinton and Harris look to most of the left. Just like the Democrats. Which is why they keep losing, and blaming literally *anything* but their unelectable candidates
@strypey @benroyce @roknrol @otownKim @jm101 @xs4me2
Concur that the party has a problem where it thinks that continuing to front centrists as the center runs to the right will maximize their odds of winning.
However... If the voters respond to that by not voting, they get the country they deserve. All of them. And the Left's flavor of "The country they deserve" is they knew things were bad and they did not step up to do the easiest thing about it.
@strypey @benroyce @roknrol @otownKim @jm101 @xs4me2 False premise along several axes. You're pretending voters (and the parties) are spherical cows.
Trump switched to the GOP because he was unelectable in the Democratic party process. The GOP is more populist than the Democratic party by its constitution.
@strypey @mark @roknrol @otownKim @jm101 @xs4me2
"i'm not lifting a finger until angels sing and magic perfect candidate appears"
you're the problem in the world
you really are
you need to fucking vote
and when you do, you get what you want
if you don't you get nothing
that's it
that's rock of gibraltar reality
no one owes you a fucking thing
you owe the world to show the fuck up
do you understand?
if you don't, as i said, your lazy entitled whiny bs is the problem in the world
@benroyce @strypey @mark @roknrol @otownKim @jm101 @xs4me2
"You can't always get what you want
But if you try sometime you find
You get what you need."
Perfection is for the gods. Aim for good enough. Especially in politics.
The word "good" does not apply to anything the GOP does. Cruel, mean, greedy or evil are better adjectives.
@benroyce
You can shoot the messenger all you want. But the hard truth is that nobody was excited enough about voting for Harris to get their friends out to vote for her. That's on the muppets who thought anointing an heir was a better idea than holding a primary
Also, Orange Stalin wouldn't have even got a first term if Dem plutocrats hadn't screwed Bernie out of a nomination he arguably won. So there's that.
@mfennvt
> That's some Russian troll talk right there
Please explain the logic underlying that conclusion. Lots of people argued for a primary after Biden stepped down, even in the liberal centre. In hindsight, I think it's pretty obvious wr were right. How does pointing this out make me a Russian or a troll?
@strypey @mfennvt @roknrol @otownKim @jm101 @xs4me2 There was no chance for a primary after Biden stepped down. "That's not how this works, that's not how any of this works."
Elections actually cost money, volunteered space, and sub-minimum-wage-paid time of under-compensated volunteers (hello!) and when they are held is encoded into state law. There is no state with a contingency plan for "If the candidate chosen by the primary process drops out of the race."
Traditionally, the contingency plan is... That candidate nominates someone else they support to run in their stead. Everything was done correctly, and if American voters don't know how their own system works, that's on them.
Ben's right about heart... Leftists really didn't demonstrate anything approximating a high intelligence or comprehension of the government they propose to provide answers for in this election.
And if they don't even understand what's already here enough to be effective, why the fuck should anyone trust them to provide a better alternative?
@benroyce @strypey @mfennvt @roknrol @otownKim @jm101 @xs4me2
Right? As if these are mutually exclusive or one isn't a years-long commitment and the other is literally an hour-ish twice a year.
They aren't competing objectives.
But on the plus side, he did get a chance to lecture a poll-worker on the interface between parties and states regarding the state-taxpayer-funded election machinery and how we could just run that multi-million-dollar process one more time, illegally, with money that just poofed into existence from fairyland.
So he has that going for him, which is nice.
@jm101 Accelerationism is boring.
@strypey @benroyce @mark @roknrol @otownKim @jm101 @xs4me2 LOLOLOL We’ve still got Bernie bros who think voting for anybody but Bernie is sacrilege, and that Bernie would win everything except he was CHEATED out of it???
Gee, isn’t there another candidate whose brainless followers insisted the same thing when he lost an election? Anybody who is Bernie-or-nobody is de facto MAGA.
@benroyce @strypey @mark @roknrol @otownKim @jm101 @xs4me2
Truth in both.
You have to show up and make hard choices to prevent the worst case.
You can't assume the masses will do this forever if you don't occasionally give them more than the lesser of two evils.
Science says rats will keep trying the button if they are intermittently rewarded. We believe in science right?
We also know that victims of trauma with no support often learn to keep their heads down and seek relief in addictions.
@benroyce @strypey @mark @roknrol @otownKim @jm101 @xs4me2
Yes. Even a long standing alternative may not be an option. In Canada the federal NDP can partner with another but are unlikely to win. They did manage to bargain with the liberal party to get things that wouldn't have been done if Libs had a majority. They also provide promises the people like for liberals to promise during elections but only deliver if forced by lack of majority.
It's messy.
@benroyce
> because the usa is fptp another party will divide the left
The election result makes it pretty obvious that most of the US left now see the Dems being controlled by the neocon right. They only look left wing by comparison to an openly fascist GoP. The two would split the right vote if there was a genuine left option. Especially in ranked choice elections.